One of the things that really struck me from the movie “End of the Spear” was that in the Waodani language, there is no word for forgiveness. The concept was so foreign to that culture that no word had ever been coined. In our Christian culture we have the word but we too often lack the ability to apply it. One of the joys of writing these daily ramblings is hearing from readers who are blessed or challenged by something I have written. Occasionally someone takes time out of their busy schedule to tell me I am an idiot. Isn’t it a waste of time to tell an idiot that he is an idiot? How can an idiot comprehend that? But I digress. The communications that are really hard for me are the ones from people who have been wounded by other people in the church or by church leaders. Those break my heart and such messages arrive far too often. Today was such a day.
I wrote a blog this week called “Boomers get ready…how soon will we be going home?”. The article was based on a mortality calculator developed for baby boomers. You could add up your variables and predict your chances of living for the next four years. But my argument was that no matter how much time we have we should live with a sense of urgency. Here are a couple of paragraphs from that post.
So how then should we live? Like Paul and Peter and John and the rest of the early followers of Christ. With an air of expectancy that tomorrow (or the rest of today) is not guaranteed. To live with a sense of priority and passion about what really matters. Do you have someone that you want to tell that you love them? Tell them now. Is there a relationship that needs repairing? Repair it now. Someone that you know you have to forgive? Please forgive them now by faith and the enabling power of the Holy Spirit. Still angry with a parent or sibling? Deal with it now. Have you slipped away from God for some reason? Come back now.
What if I told you that you have exactly one week to live? Write down what you would do and what you would say in those precious seven days. And then start doing those things now. Because no matter how stunning your score might be on the Grim Reaper Index it is no guarantee of anything past this moment. I know that not every recipient of such communications are receptive or even civil. But at the end of the day we are accountable before a Holy God only for our actions. They are accountable for theirs. Do the right thing and trust the rest to Jesus.
Today I found this response to that post.
I agree that as a follower of Christ we should not be concerned about how many days we have left, we should live each day as though it is our last. My issues to deal with are related to pain inflicted by Christian leaders on trusting and innocent people. How can anyone forgive these people who take advantage of the very ones who they are entrusted to lead, teach, and help? HOW is it possible to forgive a pastor who has deliberately lied, stolen, and strung along an innocent person? Does God really expect us to forgive such people- exploiters who manipulate the word of God in order to trick a trusting person into submission – a pastor who uses a hurting person’s unfounded guilt to his own advantage? And when does accountability come into the equation? And do we have to forgive others when we are not even ASKED for forgiveness?
Dave, is a Christian required to forgive those who have willfully lied, used and abused them with premeditation when no apology was ever offered? If I die today will I go to Hell because I cannot forgive a pastor who caused me and my loved ones excruciating pain and suffering for years? What then is the difference between a Christian and a doormat?
Wow. Anyone out there want to field this one? The message was signed “doormat”. The pain and anger in that message are heartbreaking. There is no way I can address all of the issues raised here in this space. But I did want to offer a few things and hope that this reader finds some comfort. I think that we have generally done a poor job of teaching forgiveness. Here are a few misconceptions that I personally had about forgiveness. This is from a chapter on forgiveness I wrote about in “Bring’em Back Alive – A Healing Plan for those Wounded by the Church”.
Forgiveness is not condoning or diminishing the offense. Forgiving a person who has wronged you does not mean they are “off the hook” for any consequences or judgment that may result from their actions. Forgiveness is a personal act of your will that releases the other person from your condemnation. At that point you have been obedient to what Jesus asks of you…the other person is responsible to God for their response. By extending forgiveness you are not saying the offense was insignificant or unimportant. You are saying that you trust God to see that justice is dispensed according to His Holy judgment and timing.
Forgiveness is not forgetting. The old forgive and forget admonition was one of the biggest barriers I faced in my journey to learn how to forgive. You know the old mental challenge to not picture an elephant in the room. You can’t do it. Instantly the image pops into your mind. The more I tried to be spiritually mature and try to forgive and forget the more my offender became the “elephant in the room.” That person or event was all I could think of. Over time you will think less and less of the hurt and/or the one who administered same. C.S. Lewis wrote to a friend late in his life. “Dear Mary…Do you know, only a few weeks ago, I realized suddenly that I had at last forgiven the cruel schoolmaster who so darkened my childhood. I had been trying to do it for years.” To try to achieve a state of instantaneous forgetfulness is setting yourself up for failure and frustration.
Forgiveness does not require reconciliation. Certainly it is a worthy goal to have the gift of forgiveness lead to a restoration of a damaged relationship. But it takes two people to reconcile and you have no control over anyone’s response except your own. The other person may not respond graciously. They may not be ready to accept forgiveness or acknowledge their part or even desire to be reconciled. Again, we have done what is required of us by extending the grace of forgiveness. Reconciliation is not required to be obedient to the command of Jesus.
Forgiveness is an act of the will and is not a response to feelings. We must choose to forgive and trust the Jesus who forgave us to eventually change our feelings. We may not “feel” like forgiveness has transpired. If you decide to wait until you “feel” like forgiving or that the other person must make the first move you will remain spiritually stuck. We have to make the choice and then wait for God to honor the choice. We make a choice to forgive and then we have faith that the Holy Spirit will reshape our feelings over the course of time. Forgiveness requires choice and faith, just like every miracle that comes from God.
Forgiveness is not ignoring or excusing the offense. There is nothing to forgive if we have not been wronged. Jesus is not asking us to ignore reality. He is asking us to acknowledge how much we have been forgiven and to extend the same courtesy to others. Forgiveness is acknowledging the offense without cover-up or excuse and still choosing to forgive.
Forgiveness is not denial of the hurt. Pride will often cause us to “not allow the person who hurt us the satisfaction” of knowing we are wounded. That is absurd. Acknowledge the reality of the injury but make the choice and decision of your will to be healed.
Forgiveness is eliminating revenge as an option. Lewis Smedes makes a brilliant point about revenge. No matter how much we try “we cannot get even; this is the inner fatality of revenge.” When you start trying to get even you have lost. How many times must I gossip about you to get “even” for the hurt you caused me? When is the scale even? Or do I need to have the scale tip a bit toward me to be satisfied? What a self-defeating pursuit that becomes! And the truth proclaimed by Josh Billings is “there is no revenge so complete as forgiveness.”
Forgiveness means understanding that hurt is part of the faith tour contract that we signed when we decided to follow Jesus. Author David Stoop notes that, “People choose the Path of Bitterness when they get caught up in trying to understand the reasons for the offense. They think, if only they could understand why the other person did what he or she did, they could get over it
and let it go.” I have three words for that approach….does not work.
The late author Lewis Smedes wrote powerfully about forgiveness. He often spoke of how only forgiveness can “release us from the grip of our history.” We cannot change an abusive upbringing. We cannot alter dysfunctional theological training that denied grace. We cannot simply deny the hurts that have been visited upon us and be spiritually free. Only forgiveness can release us from the grip of these real and historical events.
So I would say this to my wounded brother who wrote the message to me. Yes, I believe you do need to forgive that pastor. But the reason you need to forgive is that Jesus knew that is the only way for you to be fully healed. You have a Savior who understands the pain of betrayal. So I am going to ask you to be selfish and forgive. Say what? I have heard bitterness described as drinking rat poison and hoping the other person dies. The comparison works for me. It is vital to your spiritual well being to forgive this person. When you follow the directive of Jesus and forgive you are free to concentrate on the blessings in your life. Is this easy? Of course not. I believe that forgiveness is the single hardest thing that Jesus asks us to do. But He knows how important forgiveness is for own growth. Will you go to Hell if you die today without forgiving this person? I don’t believe that for a moment. The redemptive act of Jesus on the cross literally has you (and sins past, present, and future) covered. But why would you want to live in anger and distress when Jesus has something better for you? The Apostle Paul’s wrote these words in Colossians.
Bear with each other and forgive whatever grievances you may have against one another. Forgive as the Lord forgave you. Col 3 NIV
You and I have been forgiven of much. Thomas Fuller observed that “He that cannot forgive others breaks the bridge over which he must pass himself; for every man has to be forgiven.” A
Christian who is not forgiving is a Christian who is not growing. I am going to pray for you to make the choice to forgive. God will do the rest.
May I add that no one who has the courage and maturity to make that choice will ever be called a doormat in my book.
Andie
I arranged a reunion for former vouleteers at a “christian” radio station in the UK.
One of the number who said catagoricly she could make the time & date given and then didnt is a reverend.
I am not myself a christian, and did go on a bit of a rant on the social networking site that we arranged it through. I do suffer from severe depression (Bi-Polar) and was at thet point untreated by my Dr.
I wrote an apology about a week later & also sent her one by Email.
Should she forgive me as a good christian as I have forgiven her for not turning up?
Or is it all a lie?
Christian
Our Pastor committed sexual fornication with his female pastoral assistant. The affair had been on for 10 months. He and she joined us only a year ago. His wife caught him. Both the offenders are sorry to be caught and fired from their jobs. But not really repentant. Who has to forgive them? God or us? 1 Corinthians 5 says not to even eat with them. Your advise please.
JSJ
I am the director of a workplace, and had a worker that was just a selfish person, much like me sometimes. She seemed to cause be constant problems as her supervisor. She eventually quit, but the threat of her returning due to pull with the main guy and him letting her be a temp was a constant threat.
The consequences part really struck a cord with me. I was conflicted as a supervisor and a Christian, as how often I needed to call her in, when she has had plans most of the times I call.
As a supervisor I hope and believe I am not required to let her work as an aspect of forgiveness. That’s my struggle, I don’t know whether that’s part of forgiveness, or if that’s a consequence of her actions. The latter would take a huge load of my shoulders.
Thanks for this teaching, it was one of the best and sensible approaches I have seen, and it’s seldom you see someone telling you to forgive, and then telling you how to.
God Bless!
Endure
I was recently with a Christian man, we dated for 12 months and i even moved 9000 miles so that we could give our relationship a chance. But 2 months after i moved back, we broke up. However, the pain of the breakup was not the end of it, he started dating another Christian girl less than a week after he called things off, that really really hurt. Just like Camille, i wondered, how could a Christian man who claimed that honesty and integrity were the essence of his being, behave as he did. I was thoroughly disappointed and pained deeply. As i prayed, i felt God speak to me, and He said, ‘this is what i had wanted to save you from’. This whole experience has brought me through so much spiritual growth and now i am learning lessons in forgiveness. Thanks Dave
Lina Padua
There are some “they call themselves, Christiams” even for “little things” they get hurt ‘FOR NOTHING”. Because they were not “hand shaken” in the church; whether they were not called to say something; or because of their own “NOT NICE ATTITUDE” that most church members do not agree on what he or she said, will stop going to church and even the person who accidentally or didn’t mean to hurt them already ask forgiveness, will not accept any forgiveness.. What kind of christians are these? They ask God to forgive their sins, yet they do not know how to forgive and forget? What could you say about these?
fee
Hi Dave, I can relate to your hurt and anger. My husband and I was taken into care by a christian leader,pastor. We were on drugs,alchohol and all sorts at the time. I learnt to trust and love them with all my heart. We lived there for six years renting a house they owned. They made lots of promises but ended up kicking us out because we fellowshipped at another congregation. They turned really nasty and wanted nothing to do with us. this was two years ago and im still trying to repair the relationship because even though they hurt us so bad i still love them, how stupid am i. will i ever forgive them, I dont know, They done some pretty awful things to me and my family. I find it hard to trust other christian leaders, even my pastor now i look at him and cant help but wander if all he says is nothing but a load of crap. I try hard not to go back the way i was. Someone told me once, never give up.
Nydia Barreiro
My daughter was promised the moon, that she was going to be loved forever by our youth pastor, it lasted two months. He says he is not in love with her anymore. How can this guy be given the chance to continue to preach and be a leader in the church.
Should’nt he have some time for things to heal before he is given an authority position again?
Karina Black
WOW.
I thought *I’d* experience hurt by the church. That’s amazing. I’m really sad for so many people who have felt so much pain from Christians and attiributed it to Christ.
It’s so hard (for me) to make the choice every day to realize that Christians Aren’t Christ and stay strong in my beliefs. I hear ya, I really do. Christians can really be assholes sometimes and it’s especially hard when they’re acting "in His name" not to be mad at God, too. 🙁
I’m so sorry guys.
HKLHURT
Thanks Dave for your website.
I’m going thru the similar thing as Camilia so I can relate to what Camille said when she referred to her forgiveness coming and going in waves, and the elephant has not left there room. It’s constant struggle as my ex under my offer of the olive branch constantly took my offer of friendship as opening to get news of my confidence and cruelly use the news to hurt me again and again, and I have to forgive again and again.
What is worst is being a new Christian looking guidence and to grow in my faith, I was betrayed by my ex and the gal who has been sabotaging our r/s and who now is his new gal quotes scriptures constantly and had studied the theology of God from aclaimed institutes. The worst thing is that she uses scriptures to paint herself well and me as non-deserving and a threat to his spirituality. and he chose to believe (b’cusme, I’m a new christian trying to get to know God trying to change). being in the same workplace, I have lost my suppport from team (she is the queen bee in my all female team and has decreed that it will be awkward for me to be at the socials) at work. Then he asked for forgiveness for treating me not right during our r/s but then blamed me for the failure and keep counting things that I have done after our breakup or my attitude towards other area as undesirable.(!!!!, we broked up, I told him I have forgiven him when I requested for the breakup, and do not understand why is he still trying to hurt me even as a friend)
I’m really reaching the end cos I have been beating myself up for being stupid trying to forget and excuse him from all the hurt he has done to be, then I start to read your post, and realise that forgiving does not mean I must try to forget (been beating myself up that I cannot forget the hurts, thinking that I’m a bad christian). From your post and other people’s posting i finally realise that it’s alright.
Now, I just cut all ties with these "christians" so that I will not be too embittered towards christianity to continue my search for God. I am determined to seek God and get to know him better and I will not allow these "christians" to pull me back any further. I forgive becos this is what Jesus would do. but being new to the faith i pray for christians like yourself to continue to post clear and the truth about what God has intend to teach us, so that the rest of us beginners can grow in the faith and not be mislead by those "christians" who uses God words to get their human desires.
djgirl49
I had an affair after 29 years of marriage. We went to couseling. I asked God to forgive me. So did the man I had the affair with. My husband couldnt get over it and he filed for divorce. Now I am single but dating the other man. Is it possible to go and live a godly life since we have BOTH asked God to forgive us yet still want to date. My family says they will never meet him, because of what happened in the past. I dont feel thats true forgiveness.
If we are living for God now and going to church together, who is right and who is wrong here.
Do i need to walk away from this man because of what everyone else thinks even though we KNOW we can live for God together, since we have confessed our sins??
djgirl
me,too
I too was hurt by my pastor many years ago, but let me share with you the alternative route I took. Angry & unforgiving, I scrapped the whole ‘Christian’ life & dared God to reveal Himself & stop me as I entered the world, leaving my faith, my church, my fellowship & my God behind. God seemed silent as I tried everything the world had to offer. I experienced all kinds of relationships, only to be hurt sometimes worse than in my past, but I excused those that hurt me because I expected it, maybe even thought I deserved it. Then things got really bad & I continued to find myself surrounded by other people making bad choices too, I finally came to a point that I realized NEEDED my God back. I NEEDED Him to lean on. HE revealed (surprise) all people are human and when we put our faith & trust in humans we will be disappointed. I have often thanked God that He is my judge rather than man. I held my pastor to a high standard (and yes pastors/teachers/leaders should be held to a higher standard), but not so elevated to a point THEY can’t even live up to it. Extend GRACE ~ because it frees you to live again, it’s a gift you can give (and just as with any giving – you’ll receive). When you hang on to the anger & pain, you keep yourself from experiencing God’s best for you. He will use this for good. Looking forward to knowing HOW, because God is amazing. It may just be your testimony that will bless others ~ The ball is in your court.
God Bless<><
Dave E
I am a bit surprised that so many people seem to equate forgiveness with an absence of justice or judgement. Christ forgave me completely, but their are still consequences that accompnay my actions despite that forgiveness.
Justice and forgiveness co-exist.
There are times when we as citizens of this nation and world (Christians & non-Christians alike) have a civil responsibility to be actively involved in this justice. If the offense against us is a criminal action, then it’s our obligation to report the crime and actively seek justice for the offender through the proper legal channels that apply to the situation. But that doesn’t mean that we can’t also forgive them.
You may remember Reginald Denny who was seen on TV being dragged from his truck and severely beaten during the Los Angeles riots in the wake of the first Rodney King verdict in 1992. After his painful recovery, he met face to face with his attackers, shook hands with them, and forgave them. I do not recall, though, him asking for the charges do be dropped or for justice not to be served. Prison time was served.
When my children are guilty of wrongdoing, my forgiveness and love for them don’t take away their punishment.
Fogiveness is not excusing a wrong or pretending you can forget and go on with life. But forgiveness does involve giving up the notion of revenge and (gulp) actually coming to desire the well-being of the one who hurt you (ouch).
"Well-being" means spirtual well-being, not just physical. When someone on death row appeals that they should not be executed because they have become a Christian, I personally feel they should still be executed. That doesn’t mean I don’t forgive them and don’t desire their well-being. It means that they should still be accountable for their crime and endure whatever punishment has been set. I do want that person to experience the ultimate "well-being" in heaven (and that goes for everyone on death row). One man hanging next Christ on the cross mockingly asked him to save them physically. The other recognized that he was getting what he deserved, but asked to be forgiven and saved spiritually .. and he was.
As Dave has said, it is not easy… in fact it is unnatural. When commenting on the scene of Regiland Denny forgiving his attackers, one reporter wrote, "It is said that Mr. Denny is suffering from brain damage." Forgiveness is so outrageous that sometimes it seems like you would have to be out of your mind to do it. I’ve heard someone say that forgiveness is only needed when the only reasonable thing to do is get even.
But that is not what Christ did (even though he could have). Forgiveness is unnatural… it is distinctive.. and it is one of the things that sets those who take on the name of Christ apart … in a good way. It is far from weakness. In fact, it takes the ultimate strength (that we don’t have) to do it.
TIM
Acknowledgement is important especially when it goes both ways.
I like the idea that forgiveness does not require reconciliation. To feel an obligation as a Christian to stay in relationship with a person who has betrayed you or done something hurtful is too much. I am glad that sometimes it is allright to leave some relationships behind.
Also, that the forgiver is not condoning the action is good.
I think communication is important because so often things are misunderstood, people walk around hurt and the person who hurt them don’t even know what they did, they just know something isn’t quite right!
As far as forgiving God, I can only comment that maybe time will help, in addition to the other suggestions made by another blogger, like sharing your pain and accepting help and love from others. I understand that reaching out to others usually helps to heal yourself.
just me
"You cannot run a society or cope with its problems if people are not held accountable for what they do."
-John Leo
MY two cents worth on the subject –
I do think that being a Christian requires one to seek justice, even when it is for oneself but especially on behalf of people who are powerless.
We ought to forgive family and people who are very close to us who have hurt us. Husband and wives, sisters and brothers, siblings should forgive one another and probably not expect justice. We ought to forgive people for example who cut in front of us on the highway or a neighbor or co-worker who hurt our feelings. We should not be petty when seeking justice but we ought to seek justice in cases of extreme neglect, abuses of power, fraud, slander or harassment that effects our livelihood or mental health, or physical abuse, also in cases of civil rights or privacy violations. If laws are being broken, we ought to report it. If an angry, out-of-control person hurts you, you should not just forgive and forget. If a jealous person slanders you and sets out to ruin your reputation, you should not just forgive and forget. If a pastor takes your confidential information, realizes there is money to be made and tricks you so that he gets the profit, or takes advantage of your trusting nature to take away what is rightfully yours (which is what it sounds like happened in the quoted post), you should not just forgive and forget.
Christian leaders and law makers should be held to a higher standard than anyone else.
As Christians, we should probably try to work out our differences without going to court, but I don’t think Christians by definition have to suffer abuses and violations with a smile and say "I forgive you, I forgive you, I forgive you."
Thank you.
no name
revenge and justice are not the same
no name
you don’t have to forgive anyone who abuses you premeditatively and deliberately and who does not even ask for forgiveness especially if that person happens to be your own pastor especially if that person abused his position especially if that person took money that was not his to take especially if that person used confidential information to place himself in the driver’s seat
i love to read what dave wrote but oh please people use common sense don’t be pollyannas don’t be stupid
no
this is pathetic
oh course christians have civil rights the right to have an attorney the right to seek justice
me
forgiving is the hardest part of being a Christian because we have to turn the other cheek, love our enemies
doormat
Is a Christian allowed to have an attorney to defend his rights and to maybe even fight for damages on behalf of the wronged person? As a Christian, can I have my own attorney and can I press charges against the pastor who deliberately took advantage of me and violated my rights? Do Christians have the same rights every other citizen of this country has? Must I give up my rights?
These questions are rhetorical. Thank you for taking so much time to respond to my post. I don’t expect you to go on and on with me. I know the ultimate answer is "Jesus surrendered His rights so who do you think you are?"
I don’t think the Father of the crucified Christ imagined that His Son’s death could be one day used to manipulate believers into positions of surrendering their rights out of respect for what Christ did for him. That is the answer, I think.
I’ve read other posts where people have said that being a Christian has blessings and rewards but this is just not my experience.
I can relate to what Camille said when she referred to her forgiveness coming and going in waves. You can most sincerely have the desire to forgive, deeply and desperately, and you can actually get "there" but the memories come back like a wave and just knock you down and pull you back under. Everytime I read or hear someone comment that Christian leaders should be held to a higher standard I feel feverish and weak, and I ask myself how long before I can get the memory of this A@* hole out of life?
Patricia
Thank you for your insights, Mr.Burchett. I, too,have a hard time sometimes forgiving (and trusting) pastors who have hurt others. Unfortunately, although I attend church, I still cannot trust most pastors. Sometimes, I even have trouble trusting my own pastor, even though he hasn’t done anything really bad. The reason is because I have heard about so many people getting hurt by pastors (or so-called pastors) in the church. And we hear especially about the sex-abuse scandals, etc. Also, I witnessed a priest (I was Catholic…nothing against Catholics though) kissing a girl inappropriately and bragging that he had been kicked out of a couple of churches. I haven’t read your newer book yet, but I will soon because i know you are an excellent writer.
————————————————————————-
And for those who have been hurt by other Christians and/or so-called pastors/priests, even though you may not be able to trust them or may have a hard time forgiving them, you still can trust God. Also, may the grace and love of Christ be with you always!
Camille
Thank you for your reminder about forgiveness. I have recently discovered the extent of the betrayal of someone I loved deeply. I have gone through the exercise of trying to understand why he does what he does, and how he, who claimed that honesty and integrity were the essence of his being, could behave as he did, and treat me as he did and not claim ownership. Forgiveness has come and gone in waves. When I can get to that place of just loving him as he is, my heart is at peace. But the elephant in the room hasn’t yet left, nor have I lead it out. So thank you, your words of guidance, compassion, and sincere love helped very much.
Steve Goss
CarrieB-
You have a lot of company. Charles Darwin, Karl Marx, and a host of others, some famous, many not.
Job, Joseph, C.S. Lewis, and others had a different response.
The response is a choice, but that doesn’t make it an easy choice.
Why are you going through all this? There are lots of possible reasons.
God may be providing life experience so you can counsel others.
God may be trying to get your attention, so He can refine some of your rough spots.
God may have some entirely different reason.
At a time like this, you need a loving, compassionate church, and loving, compassionate friends. The more, the better. God’s people can and should function as the surrogate physical presence of God. (I don’t think I explained that thought well- people doing the work of God, God’s blessings being done by people…) There is also a point when it becomes time to call in the professionals. The counselors, the psychologists. Those who are trained in helping people deal with heavy duty trauma.
You can make it through. Just try to pick your friends better than Job did.
CarrieB
Forgiving people isn’t nearly as hard as forgiving God. I’ve spent the last 10 years living where my husband’s job was, taking care of his disabled brother, in churches where I couldn’t find friends, suffering all kinds of side effects as a chronic illness destabilized to the point even of hospitalization … and now I’ve been fired from my job as the result of the ravings of a supervisor who, just two weeks ago, was fired herself, having degenerated into a full-blown bipolar mania. We had just settled into a church that seemed strong, stable, and comfortable … and their new pastor is completely restructuring the ministry. I can’t take any more. And no, I can’t rely on God’s strength. I don’t believe he cares what happens to me. If he did, something good would have happened sometime in the last decade.